Jonathan: Hey, everyone. Jonathan Bailor and Carrie Brown coming at you with another living the Smarter Science of Slim podcast. Carrie, welcome.
Jonathan: Say welcome because you were recently on the road.
Carrie: I was. I was on the road for a really long time.
Jonathan: We’ve heard about your road trips in the past.
Jonathan: But this road trip really had a little bit of a watershed moment in it.
Carrie: It did, and this was a corporate road trip, not a shooting road trip so I was not…
Jonathan: Shooting with photography not…
Carrie: Right. I was not nearly as in control over the food that was available when I go on a shooting road trip then I orchestrate it myself but of course, when you go to events and conferences and stuff like that food tends to be part of the packaged but I have to say, I set out to prove that being in the corporate world, being on the road, being at conferences and events like that it was perfectly possible to stay 100 percent SANE the entire time and I did for two and a half weeks, and it was awesome.
Jonathan: The thing that made me smile the biggest, Carrie was not necessarily that you did it but how you did it and how you felt while you were doing it. You were telling me it wasn’t like gritting your teeth.
Carrie: No, not at all.
Jonathan: What was it like?
Carrie: It was surprisingly easy. It was almost always something SANE there that I could choose from.
Carrie: From the buffets. Even if 80 percent of it was inSANE, there was always vegetable options and protein always available. There were four mornings where the provided breakfast was complete 100 percent inSANE. I’m standing there looking at all this stuff and I’m going “Everyone is going to be asleep in an hour. What’s up with this?” so there were four mornings where I had to reach into my purse and whip out some beef jerky and some Quest bars so I definitely did prepare in that. I took a supply of Quest bars and beef jerky with me for the flight and for emergencies but there were only four meals out of two and a half weeks’ worth where I could not find a SANE plate of food in amongst all the conference offerings that were put in front of me.
Jonathan: I also remember you saying, Carrie, when you were describing this to me that not only were you not, “being bad” on the conference, it wasn’t like you have to fight it. It was a bit more a vegetarian who goes to a conference and there’s a bunch of hamburgers and hotdogs and they’re just like “Yeah, I’m not going to eat those hamburgers.” They’re not like “Oh my god. I wish I could eat those hamburgers and hotdogs.”
They just don’t even want them. It easy for me to say I have experiences like this because it’s like Jonathan, he’s the guy that wrote the book, blah-blah-blah-blah-blah, but this is Carrie Brown, former pastry chef, just not even looking at inSANE foods like a vegetarian looks at meat.
Carrie: I think there’s a couple of things going on there. One, the way when you eat a 100 percent SANE, the way you feel makes you want to keep eating like that. Also, eating a 100 percent SANE all the time I did not get hunger or cravings like I would if I had eaten all the other stuff which made it very easy. I was not consumed by thinking about food because I was full. I made sure I was full of SANE foods at every meal and that kept me going until the next meal. I wasn’t snacking. I didn’t need it. I didn’t want it. It was easy.
When they rolled out the afternoon snacks and 95 percent of it was inSANE, one, I pretty much didn’t even need the snack because I’d eaten so well and so sanely at lunch time but also I just picked out the nuts. I think that was typically the only SANE options. Sometimes, some afternoons they have the veggie sticks.
Carrie: But it was surprisingly easy. The more you did it, the more I wanted to do it because I felt so good and I wasn’t hungry and it kept me going. It was awesome.
Jonathan: I get so excited when I hear you say this, Carrie because we talked about how – what if we could make our body work like a naturally thin person’s body? We talked about how we can do that. That’s really why we focused on food quality and exercise quality so much because we can actually change the way our body works and having a body that pursues slimness instead of a body that pursues being over fat and similarly what you are describing is as transformational for the mind as what I just described is for the body, and this is possible, folks.
Anyone who listens to guest podcasts knows that I frequently have vegan or vegetarian guests on the podcast. Neither Carrie nor I are vegan or vegetarian. Of course, you can be a vegan or vegetarian and be SANE. It’s not what we do personally but the reason I have so much respect for vegans and vegetarians, one, they live that way in a society which does not facilitate or to make it easy and they’re very conscious about what they eat. Being conscious about what you eat is great. We should all be conscious about what we eat. The thing that is amazing to me about vegetarians and even people that practice dietary restrictions from religious reasons is how it’s not hard for them.
Jonathan: The idea for me to not eat animal products seems – that would be horrible. That just seems terrible. For me to give up animal products that makes me feel – I bet a lot of people feel when they think about giving up starches and sweets but vegetarians – there are millions and millions of people that are no better than us who have shown us that you can take a normal mind and turn that mind into a mind that what most people would perceive as pleasurable, they perceive as just not even desirable. They don’t have to fight it. They just don’t want it. Carrie, you’re demonstrating that we can do the same. We can make our mind see inSANE food like a vegetarian’s mind sees meat and that’s amazing.
Carrie: I went into it with the looking at “Okay, how much SANE food can I find?” I went into it with that “Oh, let’s find the SANE food. Let’s see how much I could find.” If there was only a couple of dishes that were SANE, I would fill my plate up. I was not polite about that because everyone else is eating all these other potatoes and whatever else. I’m just filling my plate up with the good stuff but you could tell two hours later that I was the one that was still running around like the Energizer bunny and everyone else was just… you know but I went in it. I made it like a game. How much SANE food can I find out of what’s available? How much SANE food can I find? How SANE can I make this meal out of what is there?
The other thing I did was I actually posted a bad but I posted a picture of every meal I ate on my Facebook page and actually that was kind of almost an accountability because people were expecting to see “Okay, what’s she’s eating?” and I had several people pinged me and say “I’m saving all your photos to my phone so that when I’m next on a business trip I can look at them and it will keep me focused on staying SANE. When I’m in a restaurant instead of looking at the menu, I’m going to look at your photos which will help me to focus on what I should I be eating.” Whatever works, right?
If that helps you then do it, but for me the accountability was like “Well, I’ve got to post a picture of whatever I’m eating because they’re expecting it so it has to be SANE.” That was what I wanted anyway but I think a lot of people benefit just from an unpractical visual demonstration that in this environment for two and a half weeks straight I was able to find plenty of SANE food to keep me going and I only had to resort to my beef jerky and protein bars a handful times.
Jonathan: So many good things in there, Carrie, first your approach of pursuing the positive and making a game out of it like if that – the mindset we bring to things is so profound. If we say “You can’t eat dessert until you finish your vegetables.” What’s that communicating to whoever we’re saying that to, is dessert is good and vegetables are bad.
Jonathan: Whereas if you go into a situation saying “I’m going to see how SANE I can be.” so that’s one level of awesomeness and pursuing the positive and making a game out of it. That’s why this isn’t a diet. Again, to compare it to vegetarianism, no one says a vegetarian is on a diet that’s just because they’re like “I’m just going to find the non-animal products and eat those.” We’re just going to find the SANE foods instead of the inSANE edible substances and eat those. Also, you talked about the amazing accountability that comes when we share our experiences and we have a free – folks, if you haven’t checked it out, please do it. It’s really helpful and it’s really free.
If you go to SmarterScienceofSlim.com, you could sign up, name, email, address. We take you through a 28-day program and I think the final week, the seventh step of the program is to declare your sanity, and so to in some public forum, Smarter Science of Slim community, your Facebook page, your Twitter page, email blast, your church, your community organization, you publicly say “I’m going to go SANE.” and you do things like posting pictures because that is such a profound – it’s like once you put yourself in the position of being the teacher…
Jonathan: If you want to learn a subject, try to teach it to other people.
Carrie: That’s exactly right.
Jonathan: So if you want to do this, see yourself as a teacher, as an example for your family, for your friends, for your children. Yet another reason, if the scale is your motivation, it isn’t going to work. If your motivation is to be an example for other people and you use the brilliance of, like Carrie is saying, social media, use your phone. Even if you’re not perfect, it doesn’t matter. Don’t try to go it alone. Declare your sanity and then you can do things like Carrie Brown does and you can not only transform your body but you can transform your mind, and that gets me pumped up.
Carrie: I had something to say and now I’d forgotten it. You did that the other week about beans. You forgot your ‘bean’ thing.
Jonathan: I forgot my ‘bean’ thing.
Carrie: Now, I’m forgetting what I was going to say.
Jonathan: Bean gate.
Carrie: Oh, the other thing I was going to say was when you’re in a restaurant, because there was quite a few situations where I was free to go eat in a restaurant or I had meetings with people over a restaurant meal, do not ever be afraid to say “Hold the croutons. Hold the starch. I don’t want potatoes but give me double veggies.” There was one particular night I remember where they had this fantastic salmon thing going on.
Jonathan: I love fantastic salmon thing. That’s one of my favorites.
Carrie: Yes, it was that. It was in some citrus – I don’t even remember.
Jonathan: Fantastic citrus sauce?
Carrie: It was on the menu and it came with all this other inSANE stuff. Everything that came with it was inSANE and remember I’m in Atlanta, it was a very southern kind of style; the waiter comes over and I said “I really want that salmon but I don’t want anything that comes with it.” He kind of looked at me and he said “Why not?” I said “Well because it’s not the most nutritionally dense food there is and I rather have something else.” He kind of looked at me and then he went “Well, what do you think about asparagus? Can we do this for you? Can we do that for you? How about this? How about that?”
I said “Well, that’s asparagus and whatever I was – that would be fantastic.” He trotted off. I got a fantastically SANE meal. There was no drama. He didn’t think I was a weirdo. The people I was eating with were completely unfazed by it. Don’t be afraid to just say “I would love that but could I have it with a salad instead of the potatoes?” I have never, not once have I been told “No, we cannot or won’t do that.”
Jonathan: Yeah. Carrie, it’s just another example of how – maybe this is the inspiration for another book which is SANE but more in terms of a SANE mindset like being SANE up in the mind because what you’re saying here is – again, you go to a restaurant, have some fun with it. Everyone when they hear about this initially they’re “Oh my god. I got to go to the restaurant. I’m not going to be able to eat these things.” No, think about the things you can eat now.
Carrie: Make it fun with the stuff.
Jonathan: Yeah, and have some cool substitutions. Maybe you will realize like I realized which was crazy is that putting curry like a curry dish at a Thai restaurant which I love on top of vegetables instead of on top of rice, I actually enjoyed more than putting it on rice. Seeing it as an opportunity to explore and to try new things, seeing it as something like an adventure, a game to played and something to – I heard a great anecdote story or whatever you want to call it but talking about children and video games the other day where when the child is in school and if they fail at something, they get all upset and they don’t want to try again. When kids play video games, all they do is fail. A video game is basically like you try something and you fail but then you want to try it again.
Jonathan: The act of failing is not intrinsically demotivating if it’s packaged correctly and if you approach the process correctly. If you see sanity as an adventure and a progression and just a lens at which you look through the world and you’re constantly trying to just live a SANEr life, it’s really important. I don’t want to get too far off the ranch here, Carrie but people always ask me. They say “Jonathan…” For this Carrie, you inspired me when you said I didn’t cheat at all on my trip and you I didn’t want to. Don’t you ever just want to eat a freaking…
Jonathan: Cupcake or a big Mac and some fries? Don’t you want to do that? I hope this doesn’t make me sound crazy but that’s a bit like someone saying to me “Jonathan, wouldn’t you just like to cheat on your wife?” It would be so awesome to just have casual relations with another person. It’s fun. It would make you feel good but it wouldn’t make me feel good.
Jonathan: Right? I don’t want to get too far off the ranch but the reason sometimes we eat is for an emotional satisfaction. There’s other things people do for emotional satisfaction and when you find that which is right for you – when you find yourself in a healthy relationship with another person, the idea of – it’s not like you have to struggle to not cheat on it. I think a SANE healthy relationship with food when you find that – you aren’t going to find it overnight. It may take a while.
Carrie: But the struggle does go away.
Jonathan: Oh my god. It’s amazing. The idea of cheating just like it goes away completely in other areas of life when you’re completely satisfied can also go away with food when you are completely satisfied, and that’s awesome, I think.
Carrie: However [indiscernible 17:29] girl, I always am poking my nose in and I want to say this because I know that I’m not the only one in the world that is struggling with this thing in my brain that I’m struggling with right now that I have no control over. If you read my blog, you’ll know all about that, and I know that there’s other people out there who are struggling with similar things so I don’t want those people to feel like they are somehow failing.
I’m talking specifically about certain medications can change that around you. I have times now with the food cravings are completely out of control but that is absolutely driven by a new medication that I am on. Don’t get upset or bent out of shape if you are one of those people whose cravings are being driven by something that you can’t control. Don’t let that knock you off the track. That’s my point.
Jonathan: Don’t hear what I’m saying is “I don’t have food cravings anymore.” Just like people who are in solid relationships would continue to do things that people do when they’re single, they just do it with one person instead of many different people. I had been under immense stress with the new book coming out, with the bunch of other things going on. I got to tell you, I’d been eating hella bunch of emotional eating. I had food cravings all the time.
It’s just God bless people like Carrie Brown who when I want to do something that’s inSANE, even if – I still don’t need to do that because I have SANE outlets for sweet. I have SANE outlets for salty. I have SANE outlets for fatty. It’s not you never need to feel that way again. It’s isn’t it amazing that you can now get that satisfaction while not harming yourself simultaneously, right?
Jonathan: Exciting stuff. Kudos to you, Carrie Brown for inspiring us to have transformed our minds along with transforming our bodies.
Carrie: Make it fun. If you’re out on the road, make it fun. Make it a game. Talk to the staff. Make it a competition for them to see how SANE a meal they can come up with for you because I had never met a waiter – if you do it in a fun engaging way, I’ve never met a waiter or waitress that wouldn’t get completely involved with making you happy.
Jonathan: Let’s actually get excited about this, folks because we’ve all been on planes or at conferences where they say “There’s the standard option and there’s the vegetarian option and there’s the X.” Let’s make it so that in five years, they just say “There’s the normal option, there’s the vegetarian option and there’s the SANE option.”
Carrie: There’s the SANE option. Yes.
Jonathan: Let’s be that change we want to see in the world. Let’s do that this week and every week after. We’ll see you next week. We’ll eat smarter, we’ll exercise smarter and we’ll live better. We’ll chat with you soon.
Carrie: See you.
[Audio Ends 21:08]
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