SANE Diabetes Management with Team Diabetes Daily


GINGER: Hi I’m Ginger with “Diabetes Daily” and I’m really to share with you this three part video course with New York Times Best Selling Author and SANE Solutions CEO, Jonathan Bailor.

In these videos, you’ll see how almost everything we’ve been taught about wellness, nutrition, Diabetes management and fat loss have actually been proven wrong by modern science. Best of all, you’ll get a first look and special free preview of the SANE Solution system which is actually a complete system that promises to give Weight Watchers a run for its money because it’s all about improving the quality of what you eat rather than helping you eat a 1,200 calorie diet of highly process products. Are you ready? Let’s get started.

All right. Here we are with Jonathan Bailor for the third video in our series and today we’re talking about SANE eating and Jonathan for those of you who don’t know already is the creator of SANE Solution and Healthy 2.0 and the author of “The Calorie Myth,” which is a book you’ve got to check out if you are still counting calories. How you doing Jonathan?

JONATHAN: I’m doing great Ginger. I’m really excited about our conversation today because in our previous two we covered a lot of what’s wrong, but now it’s time to talk about what’s right. So, that’s always good news.

GINGER: The carrot that you were talking about in the other one, pursuing the positive. So, let’s start with what SANE stands for. That is really the thing that you have created when you talk about good nutrition.

JONATHAN: Even in that question Ginger, you really hit on the problem, you used the
use the phrase, good nutrition. There’s nothing wrong with that, right, but the problem is good nutrition, healthy eating, these terms have become so – you ask ten people you get ten different answers. It’s a bit like if you’re in a business meeting people like synergy. What does synergy even mean? I don’t know. It’s just these kinds of buzz words.

So, we had to say look, at the end of the day, it is a fact especially in America, people are trying harder than ever in history and then in any other country to be healthy. If you look at the number of people that engage in intentional exercise that are on diets. The number of people that are going out of their way to do healthy stuff is dramatically higher in the United States than in any other first world country, however, the rates of obesity and Diabetes are also higher in the United States than any other country in the world. So, how is it that the harder we’re trying to be healthy the fatter and sicker we’re getting?

Well, maybe it’s because the definition of healthy we’ve been given isn’t all that healthy. So, that’s sort of point number one and point number two. Point number one is that if you ask ten people what’s healthy eating, you’re going to get ten different answers and that’s a problem and point number two is that chances are for at least eight out of those ten people if they’re Americans their definition of healthy has actually made them sicker.

So, what we said is we need to take a step back and we just really need to redefine healthy and we need to make it clear, we need to make it objective and we need to make it based on science and nutrition. So, everything I’m going to talk about here is based on science and it’s specific to nutrition. So, for example, it doesn’t have to do with people’s beliefs about animal rights, which is a totally valid conversation to have, but that’s not a nutrition conversation, right, that’s something else conversation. So, we’re just talking purely about nutrition and if we want to add other stuff on top of it, once we agree on what’s actually good for people, we can do that later.

What’s actually good for people? What is high quality food? If you look 0at the research over the past 60 years, it’s quite clear. There’s four factors that determine the quality of where we’re getting our calories and I abbreviate them using the acronym SANE. So, that’s where SANE comes from. It’s an acronym for the four factors that determine the quality of a calorie.

The “S” stands for satiety, so we touched on this in our earlier episodes. Satiety is just how quickly a source of calories fills you up and how long it keeps you full. So, there are low satiety sources of calories and high satiety sources of calories. Low satiety sources of calories – think about light beer. The point of light beer is so that you can drink calories and not be satisfied. That’s why it was created, right? Light beer was created because people were complaining that drinking beer made them too full to eat the hamburger that they wanted to eat with the beer. So, they created light beer.

So, same kind of thing with Pringles. Pringles have low satiety or even negative satiety. Once you pop, you can’t stop, you eat 300 calories of Pringles, it doesn’t make you want 300 fewer calories for the rest of the day, it makes you want even more calories. So, science has shown us very clearly what determines how quickly calories fill us up and how long they keep us full. We can get into that in a second, but we want to maximize the satiety of our calories. Overeating is not caused by a moral failing, it’s caused by eating foods that don’t satisfy us because if you eat foods that don’t satisfy you, you have to overeat to ever feel full. So the “S” in SANE is Satiety.

The “A” stands for Aggression. This is one that the Diabetes Daily audience is super familiar with because it has to do with the hormonal impact that various sources of calories have on us. If I were to say, what does 300 calories do to your blood sugar? Right? Where are the 300 calories coming from, right? So, we understand that just saying 300 calories is somewhat meaningless from a hormonal perspective, we have to understand where the 300 calories are coming from. So, aggression is just the term we use to talk about what is the impact that this source of calories has on your hormones. Does it aggressively attack your hormones and get them all out of whack or is it unaggressive and keep your hormone levels at a normal healthy level? So, we want to eat unaggressive sources of calories, right?

So, white bread is a very aggressive source of calories. If you take the exact same number of calories in a slice of white bread and you consume that from macadamia nuts, you are going to have a dramatically different impact on your blood sugar and myriad other hormones. So, the “S” is Satiety, the “A” is Aggression, and the “N” is Nutrition.

This is the one that everyone thinks they know the most about, but the way we’ve been taught about it is fundamentally flawed. The way we’ve been taught about nutrition is we only look at the presence of good things. Now, what I mean by that is if you look at any cereal, especially cereals marketed at children, it will say this cereal is a good source of Vitamin D, for example. They’re saying that because they’ve taken synthetic Vitamin D and they’ve injected it into a bowl of sugar.

Now, by that same logic, if I were to pour a can of Pepsi out in front of a child, we would all pretty much agree that it’s not a healthy thing. But, let’s say I now dissolve a vitamin pill in it. Did I just make it nutritious because it has vitamins and minerals in it? Not at all. So, nutrition isn’t just the presence of good things. Nutrition is the presence of good things and the absence of bad things. You have to look at both.

So why are vegetables so good for us? Because all they have is good things. There’s no bad things in them. So, then people want to have debates about fruitjuice, about the fact that of grapejuice. Is grape juice good for you or not? I don’t want to get into subjective discussions, but what I do want to tell you is that a 12-ounce glass of grape juice has 50 percent more sugar in it than a 12-ounce glass of Coca Cola. I understand that the grape juice has more vitamins and minerals in it, but nutrition isn’t defined by just the good stuff that’s in it, it’s also the stuff that’s bad that’s in it. So, that’s really important. Nutrition is about the ratio of good to bad, not just the presence of good.

One other example to help redefine this concept of nutrition, Ginger, is imagine that instead of picking up a glass of water here, you saw me snacking on a glazed donut during our conversation. You’d probably be like this guy is eating a glazed donut, what’s going on? You’d probably say that’s not nutritious and all of the viewers would say this guy isn’t eating nutritiously and I said, good point Ginger, and I walked off camera, and then I came back with a plate of donuts and I just started eating ten donuts simultaneously. I said, Ginger, look this is a more nutritious option. I’m taking in ten times more vitamins and minerals than I was before, right?

GINGER: I guess so.

JONATHAN: See, exactly. You know and all the viewers know that’s ridiculous, but that’s the logic that mainstream nutrition tells us. I am taking in ten times more vitamins and minerals, but I’m also taking in ten times more garbage. So, we intuitively know that ten donuts are not ten times more nutrition than 1 donut because intuitively we know that nutrition is about the ratio of good to bad, not just the presence of good. Does that make sense?

GINGER: Yep. Absolutely.

JONATHAN: So, Satiety, Aggression, Nutrition, “S,” “A,” “N,” and now the final letter, “E” in SANE. “E” stands for Efficiency and it’s the least well understood element of actual nutritious healing foods.

Efficiency talks to the fact that most of us don’t know this, but the average person burns about 10 percent of the calories you burn in the course of the day is just done metabolizing food. It’s just taking what you eat and turning it into usable energy in your body. There’s a bunch of chemical processes that need to take place if you’re familiar with the term “alchemy” which was the concept that in the Middle Ages people tried to take metal and turn it into gold and of course that would be wonderful if we could do that, but it had proven impossible.

Your body does metabolic alchemy every day. So, if you eat sugar for example, the donut goes into your mouth as a donut, it goes into your stomach as a donut. It doesn’t leave your stomach as a donut. It leaves your stomach as primarily glucose and so that’s metabolic alchemy. One thing chemically changed into another thing. Then the glucose circulates around your body and if you have more glucose in your bloodstream than you need, your body is going to store that as fat, but you don’t store glucose in your fat cells. You store triglycerides. It’s called triglyceride science. You store triglycerides in your fat cells, again metabolic alchemy. Your body has to take one thing, glucose and chemically change it into another thing, triglyceride. Every time a chemical change takes place, energy is lost. Something has to happen, right? So, that’s why to make your car go there is exhaust. Burning gasoline to fuel your car causes exhaust. So, these chemical changes they cause exhaust in your body.

It’s a long way of saying three sources of calories, fat, protein and carbohydrate have very different levels of efficiency in terms of being stored as fat in your body. Protein, protein isn’t even an energy source. So, you eat protein, your body is trying to use that to build your body, it’s a structural component. So, for example, if you were to overeat protein your body has to take that chicken and it has to go from chicken to amino acids from amino acids to glucose from glucose to triglyceride and you’re burning calories all over the place. In fact, up to two thirds of the calories that you consume as protein, if that protein were to end up as body fat, you’re losing about two thirds of those calories during all of those chemical changes. This is why diets or styles of eating that are isocaloric, meaning you eat the exact same number of calories, but proportionally more of them are coming from protein, almost always resulted in weight loss or fat loss, because we just burn more calories through the process of metabolizing food. So, foods vary in their efficiency as being stored as body fat.

So, that’s a lot of science, Satiety, Aggression, Nutrition, and Efficiency. The good news is what really matters once we’ve got the science in place is where do we find SANE foods?

So, SANE foods all have three things in common. They’re high in water, they’re high in fiber and they’re high in protein. Again, relatively speaking. And inSANE foods are low in water, they’re dry, they’re low in fiber, they’re low in protein and coincidentally from our previous conversations, our definition of food as things that are found directly in nature, you will find that things found directly in nature are high in water, fiber, and protein and that things you find in your grocery store shelves that are processed nonsense, are dry, low in fiber and low in protein.

So, you don’t have like how do I increase the satiety and nutrition and efficiency? No. Just eat water, fiber, protein rich foods, which really fall into four food groups. The SANEest foods in the world are non-starchy vegetables. These are vegetables you could eat raw. You don’t have to eat them raw, but you could. For example, corn is not a vegetable. It cannot be eaten raw, it’s a starch. Same thing with potatoes. It doesn’t mean they’ll kill you immediately, it just means they’re not non-starchy vegetables. So non-starchy vegetables first, then nutrient dense proteins, so these are generally coming from humanely raised animals or wild caught seafood, foods that get most of their calories from protein and are otherwise healthy for us. Then whole food fats. So, think nuts and seeds and then low sugar fruits. So fruits that have as much essential stuff, vitamins and minerals, phytochemicals, and as little unnecessary stuff, such as fructose as possible. These are things like berries, and citrus fruits and if we really just eat those food groups in that order, we’ll maximize the SANEity of our eating and we’ll heal our bodies and just do wonderful things for our health and our body composition.

GINGER: Awesome. And so before I forget, I have to ask questions and have you clarify for people. When you say high in fiber, there’s a lot of products that have a ton of fiber added and you help people understand the difference between naturally sourced fiber and Cheerios that are high in fiber?

JONATHAN: Well, the good news, Ginger, is I think we can give the viewers a tool that – Cheerios aren’t high in fiber because high in fiber has to be looked at relatively speaking. So, this is really important. So, if you take nothing else away from all of our conversations, I think this will be really empowering for you. So, here’s a trick that marketers and experts that are not versed in the modern science play on people. It’s the logic of Cheerios have more fiber in them than Frosted Flakes, therefore, Cheerios are a good source of fiber. Let’s use that logic in another way.

Cocaine has less negative impacts on your health than heroin does, therefore, cocaine is a healthy option. That doesn’t make any sense. Something isn’t healthy or a good source of “X” because it has more “X” in it than something that is terrible for you.

What we really need to do, is we need to look at all of the options available to us. And really the gold standard the food groups we talked about, non-starchy vegetables, nutrient dense protein, whole food fats, low sugar fruits. If anyone tells you that Cheerios or bread or any kind of grain is high in fiber, high in fiber relative to what? There is eight to ten times more fiber per calorie in non-starchy vegetables, especially green leafy vegetables than there are in the fiberist of grains. Again, eating is a zero sum game, meaning that you can only put so much food into your body. So, every time you eat one thing, you are not eating another thing. Is quinoa the devil? Absolutely not. If you’re eating quinoa because you think it’s a good source of fiber and in place of kale, you are doing yourself a disservice because if your goal is to increase your fiber intake, non-starchy vegetables are the best way to do that.
Eating Cheerios to get more fiber is a little bit like eating carrot cake to get more vegetables. Yes, carrot cake has more vegetables in it than chocolate fudge cake, but it doesn’t mean it’s a good source of vegetables.

GINGER: Nicely said. Okay. So, I think for someone who has never really looked at how much whole food am I eating, how much SANE food am I eating in a day, it could be really overwhelming to try to think what can I make myself for breakfast that isn’t going to take me 45 minutes in chopping vegetables. How could someone go about this in a beginner state?

JONATHAN: For both the beginner and someone who could be as advanced in this as possible, aka their whole life is predicated around it – me — I think the answer is the same for both of us and that is green smoothies.

There is no easier way to get an abundance of vegetables into your body than to use a blender. So there’s two ways to do this. One is something that’s sweeter, so when I say smoothie, that’s going to be something that you drink, you can use green leafy vegetables and citrus fruits. It’s incredibly easy. The general formula is get a green leafy vegetable — if you’re a beginner, stick with Romaine lettuce and spinach because in the future you can try kale, but it’s probably going to be a little bit too bitter for you right now.

So stick with spinach and Romaine lettuce, put a bunch of it in the blender. A blender you can buy the better it’s going to work out. I use a Vitamix, but not everyone can get a Vitamix and then take either an orange or some strawberries and just put just enough in there to help combat the bitterness and the citrus in the berries are very good at that. Don’t put a banana or grape in there. Stick with citrus and berries. Blend that up, drink it. You will take in accidentally three servings of non-starchy vegetables from the best sources of vegetables, which are green leafy vegetables every time you do that and here’s the even better news.

You can set aside 30 minutes, pop on your headphones, listen to your favorite music, listen to your favorite podcast or just set up your tablet and watch your shows. Make your smoothies for the week. Go to Costco, buy a big bag of spinach and make them for the week, set them in your refrigerator, grab them when you run out of the door in the morning.

So, you’ve got your green smoothies and then soups. So, again, use your blender and you can explore. There are some wonderful books out there for example, my podcast cohost, Carrie Brown, has a recipe book called “SANE Soups and Sides,” and you can make all sorts of soups just out of pureed vegetables. So, please don’t think you need to do a bunch of cutting and putting in Tupperware and make salads every day. I just want you to figure out the easiest and most convenient ways to get vegetables into your body almost like they’re a vitamin pill. Think of vegetables almost like taking medication. This is just something you have to get into your body because it will heal you. All that nutrition is literally healing so just get it into your body.

GINGER: And most people hear the word smoothie and they think I need yogurt, which we know is loaded with sugar. It’s one of those trickster health foods. And I need juice and I need this and that, but you’re talking about vegetables and a little bit of fruit.

JONATHAN: That’s exactly right. I’m so glad you brought that up, Ginger, because you’ll also see premade smoothies in the grocery store and you’ll see them at places at Jamba Juice, which especially if you’re a diabetic, run the other direction because –

GINGER: Watch out.

JONATHAN: Oh, my goodness.

GINGER: Seventy grams of sugar in Odwalla, the Odwalla brand that everybody thinks is so healthy. Those things are scary if you look at them in great detail.

JONATHAN: And Ginger, scary is the right word and I know you and your audience will be super familiar with this, but oftentimes when physicians do a glucose tolerance test, they give you less sugar than one of these drinks and they don’t let you leave the office so they give you 40 to 50 grams of sugar and they make you sit there in the office because they want to observe you to make sure nothing bad happens. Right? But, if you go and you buy one of these smoothies, you are literally going to take in more sugar than that glucose tolerance test. Literally, it’s dangerous to consume that much sugar.

GINGER: And if you equated the amount of sugar in a yogurt with the amount of sugar in a Coke, that might speak to somebody, but we’ve been so brainwashed to think, it’s yogurt, it’s so good for me. Okay, so we’ve got Jonathan’s secret breakfast so (Inaudible 00:22:22). I don’t expect you to give us a whole day’s menu, but just talk in general about how you create snacks and meals from whole foods that are SANE.

JONATHAN: The most encouraging thing about SANE eating is that of all the tastes that we crave, sweet, salty, bitter, umami or meaty flavor, fatty, basically the core tastes that our body wants. There are SANE sources of all of these. So, it’s not about saying you can’t have sweet things. You can’t have fatty things. You can’t have salty things. It’s just about saying, where do we get SANE sources of all of these flavors? Let me give you a very concrete example. Can you have cake? Well, if you make it out of coconut flour and you use, for example, maybe a stevia or a Xylitol or an Erythritol as sweetener, would I recommend that you eat this cake as the only source of food in your entire diet? Absolutely not, but you can understand that that cake is going to be a dramatically SANEer cake than a cake made with processed wheat flour and MSG and high fructose corn syrup that you buy from Little Debbie at the grocery store.

So, when people say, what’s a typical day like? Oftentimes, we’re able to say what are you eating right now and how can we SANEitze that? That’s what we like to say, so, for example, if you eat cereal in the morning, you can make SANE cereal and we’ve got recipes for this up at, where you’re going to be using whole food fats such as nuts and seeds, maybe like a chia seed instead of these blood sugar spiking grains.

A lot of people eat SANE sometimes already, they just don’t realize it, so if at lunch you go out and you enjoy some Tai food and any kind of Asian cuisine, most things about that meal other than the noodles and the rice are totally SANE.

So, if you want to have curry for example, just keep getting your curry, but order a side of vegetables and eat them over top of the vegetables instead of eating it over top of rice or noodles. Same kind of thing. You want lasagna for dinner? Great, just make it with eggplant noodles instead of wheat noodles. So, it’s about making these SANE substitutions and if you for example, again, to, you can see breakfast, lunch, dinner. We’re talking stroganoffs, lasagnas, desserts, there’s all sorts of ways to make these delicious comfort foods SANEly, but it just takes a little bit of time to learn how to do that. There is no such thing as a SANE Snickers bar. It doesn’t exist because a Snickers bar isn’t food, right? But if it’s food, if grandma would have made it, we can make a SANE version of that for you and you can learn more about that at

GINGER: Awesome. Awesome. All right. I didn’t know if you were trying to end it there or if I’m allowed to ask another question.

JONATHAN: You can ask another question.

GINGER: I don’t know how long we’ve been recording.

[Note to edit for Jonathan at 25:27]

JONATHAN: I’m going to take a quick note to edit this. Part 3 edit at 24:00 minutes. So, okay do you want to do just kind of pick up like, oh, So, that’s a good segway into blah-blah-blah.

[end of editing for Jonathan at 25:44]

GINGER: Okay, so and SANEitizing foods, I’m going to ask you about my husband’s classic lunch. I’m not in charge of what this man consumes in a day. I don’t think he would know what to do with himself if he didn’t have a turkey sandwich with some kind of bread. There’s only one type of bread I’ve ever found in the bread aisle that doesn’t have corn syrup in it and it’s Arnold’s brand, but that doesn’t mean it’s a healthy bread, right, it means it doesn’t have corn syrup and then Swiss cheese, mayo and mustard. He wouldn’t know what else to eat for lunch. And that’s a pretty classic American lunch. How would you SANEitize that kind of meal so that someone like my husband could eat a healthier lunch?

JONATHAN: I’m not doing the political answer here of not answering the question. I will answer your question, but the first thing is, I would first check to see if your husband actually wants to improve his health.

GINGER: Great point.

JONATHAN: That sounds a little bit silly, but there are plenty of people for example that smoke. It’s not that they don’t know that’s smoking is bad for them, they’re just saying, I would rather smoke than not die of lung cancer.

GINGER: Right. You have to want it first.

JONATHAN: So, you have to want it first and if you then want it first, you then say to yourself, what is it about that sandwich that I love? Most of the time it’s not the store bought bread. When you have the best stir fry you’ve ever eaten. You probably weren’t saying, you know what made that stir fry the best stir fry I’ve ever had? It was the rice. The rice was just so good.

If we’re going to eat inSANE substances, like breads, and sweets, it doesn’t mean you can’t ever do that, it just means only do it when it’s worth it. So, if you’re in France and there is artisan baguettes available from emmer wheat that was used in biblical times, and you want to eat some of that, go ahead. If we’re just talking about this is lunch and I’m not really paying attention to it and I’m typing on my computer anyway, so whatever, maybe just have the same contents of that sandwich, but put make it a lettuce wrap or use something like a lower net carb more of an almond based flour or bread which are becoming more and more available and you can buy more and more off the Internet. I would say that would be the number one recommendation, is what is it that I’m really craving about this? What is the taste that I’m really craving? Because oftentimes starches are just filler. Especially if we start to enjoy the taste of fats more you don’t need starch to feel full. You need vegetables, you need protein and you need fat to feel full. And that can really, really help you out. So, step number one is you’ve got to want it, and step number two is, then really just identify what you really want and if you’re a type of person who’s just like look, I am not going to stop eating bread. There are people who say I’m not going to give up smoking and that’s cool and I’m fine with that. I’m not here to convert people. What I’m here to do is to say if you smoke, you might get lung cancer. If you routinely eat processed bread, you may become diabetic.

GINGER: You will struggle with your weight.

JONATHAN: So, again, it’s about making these choices, but historically, Ginger, we haven’t had the ability to make these choices. Imagine that we didn’t know smoking was bad for us and that’s the way it was 100 years ago. A 100 years ago, there were doctors in ads saying, smoking is good for your T-zone. And everyone smoked. So in that case, like you don’t really have a choice because you think smoking is good for you. The beginning of this conversation was healthy eating, what is SANE eating?

If we’ve been told that something is healthy because it’s low calorie or because it’s low in fat and those are the only criteria to make it healthy, again, even if we want to be healthy, if we don’t have the correct information we can’t be. So, step one is wanting it. Step two is having access to the correct information so that you can actually have success doing it and that’s again what we try to provide at SANE Solution is that correct information because if you want evidence for the current definition of healthy failing, look around. It’s clearly not working.

GINGER: Right. Right. Yes. Okay. So, maybe we could end this takeaway on this video with the takeaway because lunch is one of those things that people again are in a rush and they’re in their office, they can’t go and sauté some broccoli the way I can because I work at home. What is a really simple food they can pack examples for lunch that is SANE, truly SANE?

JONATHAN: Truly SANE. Easiest example is saying unless all you eat for lunch is starch and sugar, which is probably not the case, unless your entire lunch is a bagel dipped in glaze, take the SANE elements of your lunch, so take whatever vegetable you are already eating. Take whatever protein you are already eating. If you like nuts, there’s your fat, just eat more of those. Again, like dinner. Just take your current dinner or making some of it and then eating a bunch of rolls, just eat more of the main dish, right?

GINGER: Don’t be afraid to eat the real nutrient, people are so afraid to eat than more seven almonds because almonds have fat in them. Eat your almonds.

JONATHAN: That’s exactly right. If you’ve ever gone to a barbecue, chances are you ate pretty SANE, right? There’s healthy, there is nutrient dense meats there, there were vegetables there, you grill it up, you’ve got your good stuff, maybe you just don’t put it on a bun. This isn’t saying just eliminate everything it’s just saying eat so much non-starchy vegetables, nutrient dense protein, whole food fats, low sugar fruits, identify what you like within those food groups, chances are you are already eating foods in all of those food groups. All I’m saying is just double the amount of food you’re eating from those food groups, so that you’re too full for the inSANE starch and sweetener processed nonsense food groups.

GINGER: I like it. Can you say one more time those four, there’s non-starchy vegetables –

JONATHAN: Nutrient dense protein –

GINGER: Nutrient dense proteins –

JONATHAN: Whole food fats —

GINGER: Whole food fats –

JONATHAN: And then low sugar fruits.

GINGER: All right. So, take that away with you people and go examine what your lunch looks like and have those four things add up in there.

JONATHAN: I’m going to be very clear with folks. The good news is we’ve got to relearn this, right? That’s why we have set up the programs we’ve set up, is we’ve been given misinformation for 40, 50 or 60 years. It’s going to take more than four to six minutes to unlearn all of that stuff, but once you unlearn it, you’re done. It’s like knowing how to drive. You know how to drive. You can now get anywhere in the world, once you know how to eat SANEly and you have that underlying fundamental knowledge, all things in life can be addressed so it’s not some checklist in your mind, you just have that foundational knowledge and again, you can get that at

GINGER: And Pringles won’t taste good anymore to you. You will have one and you will stop because you’ll be like this is not food.

JONATHAN: Absolutely.

GINGER: Nice benefit of a SANE solution that you want more real food.

JONATHAN: exactly, it’s a self-fulfilling, it’s a virtuous cycle.

GINGER: Yes, All right. All right. Thank you Jonathan.

JONATHAN: Thank you Ginger.

GINGER: Hey, Ginger again. I hope you enjoyed that as much as I did. Be sure to click on the SANE Solutionlink on this page to get your free Diabetes Daily SANE Solution Plan and to learn more about SANE solution, visit Thanks for watching, see you again soon.